1. Alan has completed the new Pain Recovery Program. To read or share it, use this updated link: https://www.tmswiki.org/forum/painrecovery/
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New Program Day 5: Changing Your Brain

Discussion in 'General Discussion Subforum' started by Alan Gordon LCSW, Jul 15, 2017.

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  1. fbcoach

    fbcoach Peer Supporter

    Hi Kat,
    Before I post a reply, I want you to know where I am coming from. I am by no-means an authority on this, but I am just sharing my limited experience. Long story-short....I am a 58 yr old male and have been a competitive athlete most of my life. In 92' I broke my neck in a Football accident. Since then, I have had every type of therapy, surgery, drug regimen etc. One of my biggest fears is overtraining (doing too much). I have been able to overcome this somewhat by gradually doing a little more over the last year. I wasn't afraid of heavy lifting, but by performing it too often. Eventually I proved to myself that I can do much more heavy lifting than I thought possible. It was thru trial-and-error, but it has worked. I am by no-means pain-free, but my fear of over-doing it has diminished somewhat. It takes a lot of courage to try, but I think we all have this inside of us. I wish you well in your journey.
     
  2. karinabrown

    karinabrown Well known member

    Hi Alan,

    Sitting here on the other side of the world reading your program en reading the replies from all the people with pain like me out there .. its great and i really think something really good is being created here.

    Been on this forum for some time but this program really is a great new tool : Thank you so much for taking the time and all your effort !

    And to Christy : Thanks too : you opened one of my eyes at least : always thought that truelly being cured' would mean : zero pain and never again : you pointed out to me that its Okay if sometimes a little 'twist' arises ..which means i can aim a little lower too ..
    I am still learning .. and still working on it
    Thanks for this great website and thanks for everone willing to share their stories.

    Karina.
     
    caligirlgonegreen likes this.
  3. caligirlgonegreen

    caligirlgonegreen New Member

    I like to think of it like this: The pain isn't IN your head, but rather it's coming FROM your head. I hope that helps you.
     
  4. caligirlgonegreen

    caligirlgonegreen New Member

    Thank you for this link, Plum!
     
    plum likes this.
  5. shmps

    shmps Peer Supporter

    I still have a question on destructive thoughts.. Catch the fear thoughts, but what do you do with them. And when so many come one after another and keep going on, how do you snap yourself out of it to be able to notice it than experience it specially if its related to a current situation in life.

    do you do somatic tracking, cognitive soothing ? what when you notice the spiral of fear thoughts increasing and turning into a tornado. For me its fear thoughts related to people than pain itself.
     
  6. Alan Gordon LCSW

    Alan Gordon LCSW TMS Therapist

    I look at persistent fear thoughts as nothing more than an indication that your primitive brain is feeling unsafe.

    You don't need to necessarily snap yourself out of it, you just want to attend to yourself. If the fear thoughts stop, great. If they keep going, that's okay too.

    It's a long term strategy. Over time, the brain has the capacity to learn a feeling of safety.

    With regard to which intervention to use, you can use cognitive soothing, somatic tracking, or both at the same time. It's a matter of whatever feels right for you.
     
    caligirlgonegreen and shmps like this.
  7. shmps

    shmps Peer Supporter

    Thanks Alan!
     
  8. shmps

    shmps Peer Supporter

    ALAN's POST on Another Thread:
    "The purpose of mindfulness is to hone the ability to watch the thoughts, etc. and not get pulled in to the emotional response to the thought.

    For example, let's say you have the thought, "My symptoms are never going to go away." The typical emotional reaction to that thought is fear, and the typical physical response to that is anxiety.

    If you're practicing mindfulness meditation and that same thought comes up, the goal is to say to yourself, "Oh, there's that thought again," and then return your attention to the breath. So essentially you're watching the activity of your mind, and intervening before you have the emotional reaction or the physical response."


    Alan, I found this post of yours someplace else but based on this what I understood from your previous reply is that, we want to reach a place where we don't give fear thoughts (pain related or not) any emotional reaction. That is when we can say our primitive brain FEELS SAFE?
     
    gailnyc likes this.
  9. adria

    adria Peer Supporter

    Hi Christie
    I would like to know if you do skype consultations and if so how much are they.
     
  10. adria

    adria Peer Supporter

    Where can i find out about these interventions
     
  11. SebastianM

    SebastianM Peer Supporter

    100% me :p.

    I Wish u the best to reach this State... I also try to wake up without scanning! That would be great
     
  12. Livinginhope

    Livinginhope Peer Supporter

    So today, after taking a new supplement for candida, I awoke with raging stomach pains, nauseous and unable to do anything. Is there any surprise that my original pain for coming to this site seems to be receding and that I am due to go to a traditional ortho doc on Monday to see if there is any structural problem? I do believe that this supplement did not agree with me, but not to this extent.
     
  13. Hpsage721

    Hpsage721 Newcomer

    Alan,
    I have a question regarding pelvic pain. I have spoken to you and Dr. Schubiner over the phone and via email. I even had sessions at your practice with one of your therapists. Many of us who have pelvic pain, pn, or cpps, have pain when sitting. The longer we sit the worse the pain gets. Starts off ok in the morning and progressively gets worse as the day goes on. Now, in the recording with Christi you say to her if it was a structural issue her thumbs would hurt more the longer she typed. So, this is the biggest hurdle for me. Thinking how can it not be structural because when I stand up, the intensity of the pain diminishes tremendously? I know that there are people with pelvic pain who have gotten over this hurdle and want to know what did it for them? I've had anxiety, tmj, back pain, etc and have dealt with them. However this pelvic pain is a real bear because it's so conditioned and in the worst possible area. I would appreciate your feedback and also anyone else that is familiar with pelvic pain. Thanks.
     
  14. Hpsage721

    Hpsage721 Newcomer

    Christie,
    I have a question regarding pelvic pain. I have spoken to Alan and Dr. Schubiner over the phone and via email. I even had sessions at your practice with one of your therapists. Many of us who have pelvic pain, pn, or cpps, have pain when sitting. The longer we sit the worse the pain gets. Starts off ok in the morning and progressively gets worse as the day goes on. Now, in the recording with Alan he says to her if it was a structural issue her thumbs would hurt more the longer she typed. So, this is the biggest hurdle for me. Thinking how can it not be structural because when I stand up, the intensity of the pain diminishestremendously? I know that there are people with pelvic pain who have gotten over this hurdle and want to know what did it for them? I've had anxiety, tmj, back pain, etc and have dealt with them. However this pelvic pain is a real bearbecause it's so conditioned and in the worstpossible area. I would appreciate your feedbackand also anyone else that is familiar with pelvic.. thanks
     
    marco likes this.
  15. kkcarlton

    kkcarlton Peer Supporter

    I have a question about on-going pain although I am not in fear. I came to this forum due to back pain. However, sometime end of May I started having pain in my right heel when I walk/run. As soon as it started I figured it was due to an old neural pathway since I had this same pain in the 90s (and was told to stop running). So I just keep on walking, jumping rope, running, etc. and every time I do the pain gets worse and then improves after a day or two. Because I have been preoccupied with outcome independence for the back stuff, I have not paid any attention to my heel. I don't think about it, worry about it, I don't fear it because it's not horrible, I don't pay attention to how long it takes for pain to set in when I do walk, actually, I pretty much forget about it until it starts hurting again. Despite all of this it is still here. Am I expecting too much? I figured since I am not concerned or preoccupied with it that it should have improved by now.

    Thank you...
     
  16. Alan Gordon LCSW

    Alan Gordon LCSW TMS Therapist

    For most people, the pain is very consistent. The longer you sit, the worse the pain gets...when you stop sitting, the pain starts decreasing, etc. Although having an inconsistency can be more evidence that it isn't structural, having no inconsistencies certainly isn't evidence that it is structural.
    Great question. It's not about preventing the pain from coming on, it's about changing the way you respond when it does. When it does come back, how do you respond? If you are literally indifferent and the pain persists, I'm guessing there may be some doubt over whether there's anything structurally wrong with you. It's always a good idea to consult with a TMS physician to A.) rule out physically causes, and B.) confirm to the primitive part of your brain that it's not physically caused. It can serve as both a physical and psychological intervention.
     
  17. kkcarlton

    kkcarlton Peer Supporter

    I am not a therapist but thought I would share my experience talking to people with pain. I have found that the wording I use is important. If I tell someone their pain is all in their head, without explaining further, the person usually has a negative reaction to what I am saying. So if I am talking to someone with pain, I usually don't even say that the pain is in the head. I just try to explain (as best as I can) how pain and the brain works. The story about the construction worker with the nail through his boot really helps, too.
     
  18. kkcarlton

    kkcarlton Peer Supporter

    Hi Alan, thank you for your response and all the time and effort you have put into this program and helping people. It is very, very much appreciated. With the heel pain, I really don't even think about it or try to prevent it from coming on. The other symptoms (back pain, fatigue) are pretty overwhelming right now, and I am working on outcome independence, etc. on those, so that I don't even think about the heel pain until it starts to hurt. I did see Dr. Schubiner who felt that it was most likely due to TMS. He asked if I had any x-rays, which I didn't, but then said that even if it's a heel spur it shouldn't cause pain. So maybe there is still some lingering doubt about the cause of the pain. Thank you again!!
     
  19. Phyldancer

    Phyldancer New Member

    Christi's audio was so helpful. I've been struggling with knee pain in one leg for 20 years and have favored the left leg, so much so that my right thigh is atrophied from lack of use! I've been slowly building up strength again in the right leg but every day struggle with unpredictable knee pain. Some days it hurts like hell just to lift my leg off the gas pedal and other days I can practice squats. I've spent the last hour or so testing my right leg (straightening and bending from a chair). At first it was killing me and now I feel no pain. I tried it 15 minutes later and pain again. Waited...no pain. Hard to know what my brain is doing but nice to know there is change!
     
  20. Ko'olina27

    Ko'olina27 Newcomer

    I read this last night and when I read the Winnie the Pooh quote at the end it gave me an extra boost of confidence. I just happen to have it hanging on my wall! I didn't even know it was from Winnie the Pooh. Now this poster will be an extra reminder that I will not always be afraid!
     

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