Why do some have success, others don't?

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vixb

New Member
I'm new to TMS having only been introduced to it a few weeks ago and then realising I had the Mind Body Description book on my Kindle since 2022, obviously not read it fully! My chronic pain has been going on for more 10 years. I'd had the pain (back and neck) for a few years prior to having an MRI in 2014 which identified 2 herniated discs. I have just been managing the pain since 2014 using physical therapy. Not once did I use any painkillers during this time. I' have also been a meditator since 2012 and used to have a regular yoga practice (stopped during 2020) and honed in on building a spiritual practice. It seems I have already been using some of the tools suggested by Dr Sarno. Journalling and breath work I did on/off for years. What is interesting to me is how the pain can move around the body and now I can probably say I feel pain in all parts of my body - not at the same time but it moves about randomly and new parts being affected as time has gone on. I have never allowed the pain to restrict my physical activity apart from when the headache is so debilitating I have to lie down. I have stopped my yoga practice, not because of the pain, although I did avoid postures that would impact the neck.

It seems, unaware, I've been following a lot of what is suggested not knowing this is TMS. Why then does the pain persist? And why do some people fully recover? I also watched some of Dan Buglio's success stories where they say that one never becomes pain free but they just manage it better, yet the title of his website is "pain free". Can someone please help suggest what I can add to my toolkit as I would like to be pain free? I think definitely more consistent daily journalling. I've also had years of counselling/various talk therapy so I am pretty self aware. Could it be that I am still indulging in the fear? I know my pain well enough to know that it will pass but it is still really uncomfortable whilst it is there. Some of the pain I come to expect, e.g. waking up with neck pain on the left side and occasionally accompanied by a headache, when driving for longer periods I get piriformis or sciatic pain in the left buttock due to using my left foot on the clutch, thumb pain if I do too much texting... etc. Other pain I have no idea why it's there and I'm not sure if that matters in TMS.

One thing I can say is I have had a long battle about my choice of career. I had a chosen a "safe" option but one that did not fulfil me at the soul level and have made umpteenth attempts to change it only to go back to the "safe" option. I recognised this in my twenties but the pain didn't really start until my early-mid thirties.
 
vixb said:
It seems, unaware, I've been following a lot of what is suggested not knowing this is TMS. Why then does the pain persist? And why do some people fully recover?
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These are important questions that are discussed a great deal on this Forum.

Recovery from TMS requires a major psychological shift. The techniques, exercises, and programs that are recommended are designed to help facilitate that shift. However, because we are dealing with the human psyche and all its infinite variations and complexity, there is no "one size fits all" prescription for recovery. Some people read a book or two and recover, while many work the available programs diligently for long periods of time yet make very slow progress. Some people experience a recovery that leaves them pain free with an occasional relapse (this is my case), while some just reduce their symptoms to a tolerable level.

My best recommendation is to pick one of the TMS programs and/or teachers that resonate with you the most and follow that program daily as best you can. If you get to the end of it and find little progress, then pick another and commit to it all the way through. I encourage you to read and listen to lots of Success Stories and books about TMS. But don't let your study of TMS become an obsession. Limit the time you spend on it daily, and then go about living your life fully.

Welcome to the Forum! Feel free to continue to ask questions. We are all here to support one another.
 
I'm new to TMS having only been introduced to it a few weeks ago and then realizing I had the Mind Body Description book on my Kindle since 2022, obviously not read it fully!

To start with, I would hold off on making any conclusions yet as to how you will be. First things first, take the time, like one week or however long you need, where you read one book and give it your full undivided attention. Don't do anything else. Take a stay at home vacation. You can refer to your own past medical studies if you like, if you read something that seems relevant to your own past workups. Dr. Sarno knew what he was talking about. Let him "teach you literally everything [he knew] about TMS." Give yourself this period of what I like to call "expansive peace" and let it sink in. For you I'd suggest Healing Back Pain.

I myself was given diagnoses of herniated discs, degenerative disc disease, radiculopathy, and cervical myelopathy. I first read Healing Back Pain about a year and a half ago in the manner I suggested to you. It was like the hand of God passed over me (I haven't been a religious person but it's a good way of describing it). All pain completely disappeared. At baseline, I am 100% pain free, but I do have short-lived relapses from time to time. The more I learn about this work and observe other people, I will also say this: I don't know of any other person who is totally free, at all times, of all symptoms of TMS and its many equivalents. Not one. Not even Dr. Sarno himself, as he said in his books. It is an emotional barometer, a part of life.
 
Ellen said:
My best recommendation is to pick one of the TMS programs and/or teachers that resonate with you the most
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I want to revise this after giving it some thought. I think it may be better to pick the TMS program/teacher that makes you the most uncomfortable. That is probably a better indicator of what would advance one's TMS recovery the most.
 
Ellen said:
I want to revise this after giving it some thought. I think it may be better to pick the TMS program/teacher that makes you the most uncomfortable. That is probably a better indicator of what would advance one's TMS recovery the most.
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I thought that but didn't want to post it...but @Ellen did anyways!

"What part of my life is causing my TMS?" The one you least want to talk about and defend with "Oh...__________ is Fine...I love my _______."
or , just get angry that people would Dare to think that. Indignation and familiarity.
clarinetpath said:
To start with, I would hold off on making any conclusions yet as to how you will be. First things first, take the time, like one week or however long you need, where you read one book and give it your full undivided attention.
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I feel like a lot of the new people are overwhelmed and it's sort of turned into a Buffet. If you are drawn towards a certain teacher because he feels comfortable, says the right things and has a soothing voice....that is NOT gonna help you. You will become stuck. That's how my Pain Doctor spoke in the chronic pain center....and no one got Free

Sarno was the simplest and to the point. It's about Anger. Period. It might mask itself as a lot of other things, but if you go hunting for murderous, repressed hidden rage you will get better. 2-6 weeks. If me saying that bothers anybody, put MY name at the top of your List of people that bug you that you want to punch. There... I helped you along

I don't know if there is anyways to know stats on this, but it seems like everybody got better faster when there was just Sarno...a To-the-point, curt, maybe a little crabby old Sicilian man. He reminded me very much of my Uncle Fred, who I was always a little scared of. ..and who almost certainly walloped me once or twice, but really cared about me.
 
Ellen said:
I want to revise this after giving it some thought. I think it may be better to pick the TMS program/teacher that makes you the most uncomfortable. That is probably a better indicator of what would advance one's TMS recovery the most.
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That's an interesting observation. That makes total sense to me. Thanks.
 
Ellen said:
I think it may be better to pick the TMS program/teacher that makes you the most uncomfortable.
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Agree 100%
Baseball65 said:
"What part of my life is causing my TMS?" The one you least want to talk about and defend with "Oh...__________ is Fine...I love my _______."
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And this
Baseball65 said:
If you are drawn towards a certain teacher because he feels comfortable, says the right things and has a soothing voice....that is NOT gonna help you.
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And this too.
 
Baseball65 said:
but if you go hunting for murderous, repressed hidden rage you will get better. 2-6 weeks
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I would give a million dollars to get better in 2-6 weeks! I did Sarno work every day for an hour for 6 months. Made notecards for both Divided Mind and HBP. Journaled. Tried everything. Then decided I was the one he was talking about who needed therapy. So got 3 years of brutal therapy that dug very deep into my childhood rage issues. I think that just made my anxiety way worse. So I’ve backed off. I’m not looking for a soothing voice. I’m looking for any way possible to get better. I’m only saying this cuz there might be others like me out there. After all this: I still believe I can heal. I just haven’t gotten there yet. And you could be right. Maybe I just haven’t found that murderous thought yet. But it’s hard to believe I haven’t come close. I believe you though. And I’ll keep trying!

I will add that Nichole Sachs scares me the most! So I’ll head in that direction. :)
 
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Ellen said:
Same here. I avoided her like the plague for a while, and then realized she was just the approach I needed.
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Can you elaborate on what scared you the most about her? If not that’s okay.
.
 
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HealingMe said:
Can you elaborate on what scared you the most about her? If not that’s okay.
.
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Have you read anything about journalspeak? It’s her form of journaling. It’s brutally honest. I can’t explain it. But it’s hard. The first time I ever tried it, my symptoms subsided for an afternoon. It didn’t last, but it definitely got my TMS brain’s attention!

Check out her podcast-The Cure for Chronic Pain. Start at the beginning.
 
Diana-M said:
Have you read anything about journalspeak? It’s her form of journaling. It’s brutally honest. I can’t explain it. But it’s hard. The first time I ever tried it, my symptoms subsided for an afternoon. It didn’t last, but it definitely got my TMS brain’s attention!

Check out her podcast-The Cure for Chronic Pain. Start at the beginning.
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I will revisit it again. I guess I thought it was similar to the SEP in terms of journaling, same with Dr. Schubiners workbook, lots of writing.
I believe one of her suggestions was to write or type with your eyes closed. It can be very powerful and emotion inducing. I can attest to it that it definitely was when I tried it.

I have listened to a couple of her podcasts. I like how she speaks about everything.
 
Baseball65 said:
it seems like everybody got better faster when there was just Sarno...
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I'm gonna have to disagree with you there, Marco. Or, rather, I'm going to say that you have to be careful about Association vs Causation. I think you're seeing an association that is coincidental with the times. Because what I see is that the world has changed SIGNIFICANTLY since the early days of this forum, never mind the early days of Dr Sarno's practice - and many of the changes which affect our mental well-being are pretty negative.

The younger generations have been brought up with more pressures, fears, and anxiety, unbelievable obsessions about safety and cleanliness, and obviously a lot more technology and information overload - all on top of rapidly escalating world dysfunction - since the beginning of this century.

We never used to see so much OCD, and we never used to get so many very young people, especially so many young people reporting multiple symptoms from their early teens.

The times are changing, my friend, and not for the better. Happy new year.
 
Ellen said:
I felt she was too "touchy feely". She deals with emotions head on and with brutal honesty. I sensed that she could see through all my defenses and b.s. There is no place to hide from her, so I have to get to the core of my emotions.
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Oh yeah, I can see that. Thanks for elaborating :)
 
JanAtheCPA said:
The times are changing, my friend, and not for the better.
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I agree, it's hard to compare Sarno's results because it's unfair to the therapists working in the present era, having also to treat all the anxiety and emotional problems caused by the online life. Not to mention covid, global warming, unemployment caused by AI solutions etc

Also, as TMS gets more and more studied, it's natural different fields of thoughts will emerge.
 
HealingMe said:
Can you elaborate on what scared you the most about her? If not that’s okay.
.
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I just listened to this excellent interview of the actress/celebrity Catherine Oxenberg by Dr. David Clarke about her TMS journey.

At about 27:40 she discusses reading Nicole Sach's the Meaning of Truth and how she had an impact on her recovery.
 
JanAtheCPA said:
I'm gonna have to disagree with you there, Marco. Or, rather, I'm going to say that you have to be careful about Association vs Causation. I think you're seeing an association that is coincidental with the times. Because what I see is that the world has changed SIGNIFICANTLY since the early days of this forum, never mind the early days of Dr Sarno's practice - and many of the changes which affect our mental well-being are pretty negative.

The younger generations have been brought up with more pressures, fears, and anxiety, unbelievable obsessions about safety and cleanliness, and obviously a lot more technology and information overload - all on top of rapidly escalating world dysfunction - since the beginning of this century.

We never used to see so much OCD, and we never used to get so many very young people, especially so many young people reporting multiple symptoms from their early teens.

The times are changing, my friend, and not for the better. Happy new year.
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I feel like Covid and all the happenings during those 2 years sent so many people into “nervous breakdowns.”It was just all too much. Especially if you already had issues. That’s what happened for me. And some of those hyper-vigilant nervous illness symptoms are TMS-like or are combined with TMS. I think anxiety plays a huge role for some of us. Maybe all of us?
 
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