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Scared of getting vaccinated causing stress.

Discussion in 'General Discussion Subforum' started by stevow7, May 13, 2021.

  1. Dorado

    Dorado Beloved Grand Eagle

    I got the vaccine. Sita, there are certainly many opinions regarding the vaccine out there, and I recommend throughly doing one’s research outside of one article or one opinion. I support vaccines and recognize how they impact the entire community plus help us get back to normal. I also realize I can’t make decisions for everyone else - like my relative who has had reactions to other vaccines and will have to work through that with their doctor, not me. (Edit: I edited this post because I don’t think it was direct enough.)

    If one does get the vaccine, I think anybody with an anxious personality needs to accept that human vulnerability exists.

    If one does not get the vaccine, but ends up with COVID, the same applies: I think anybody with an anxious personality needs to accept that human vulnerability exists.

    I've seen this go both ways on the TMS forums. You've got people who are afraid of long-term COVID and you've got those who are terrified of long-term vaccine side effects. To me, that's the real issue I'm focused on when posting on these forums.
    Balsa11 and FredAmir like this.
  2. LMB

    LMB Peer Supporter

    I don’t think it’s your body your choice, vaccines are to protect others not just yourself. People who don’t get vaccinated will be the first to run for help if they get covid, if you don’t want to get vaccinated for yourself do it for your loved ones, I can’t believe health professionals on this forum are still thinking about it.
  3. Dorado

    Dorado Beloved Grand Eagle

    LMB, I got vaccinated (both doses of Pfizer and I’m beyond grateful). My focus is more on TMS and the concern regarding the notion of permanent damage or long-term issues. I strongly recommend that’s what we focus on in this thread - because that theme will repeat itself in other aspects of one’s life.
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  4. Sita

    Sita Well known member

    I had the virus and recovered. No side effects.
    megank, BloodMoon and FredAmir like this.
  5. tgirl

    tgirl Well known member

    QUOTE="Sita, post: 128066, member: 6712"]I had the virus and recovered. No side effects.[/QUOTE]

    You were lucky. Not everyone who gets the virus has such a positive outcome. I didn’t add this to my post so I’m updating it. My neighbour died from Covid, and she was an otherwise healthy woman. They can’t figure out why she died from it. This is happening everyday.
    Last edited: May 22, 2021
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  6. Sita

    Sita Well known member

    You are right. Not everybody, only the majority.
    BloodMoon likes this.
  7. Dorado

    Dorado Beloved Grand Eagle

    The OP is concerned about long-term effects from the vaccine and I don't think this is limited to the vaccine - I think there's been a pattern of this type of worry demonstrated over time. So how does one handle uncertainty? How do you accept that any decision you make may incur some type of vulnerability? I strongly encourage answering and focusing on those questions.

    I believe in getting the vaccine and did so for myself and my community, but again I recognize I can't force anyone to do anything. My posts are not intended to be "wishy washy" (my friends and family know I'm anything but when it comes to this topic), but I think focusing on the themes above will benefit the OP the most. I also believe we've come to a point where there are some strong opinions in this thread and trying to change them is unlikely on a mind-body forum.
    Zuz, Ellen, TG957 and 2 others like this.
  8. Balsa11

    Balsa11 Well known member

    Same, a family friend passed away from COVID before vaccines came out and I still think about how he would have survived if there were vaccines available and he had been vaccinated in time.
    tgirl and TG957 like this.
  9. Balsa11

    Balsa11 Well known member

    Yep, both can be scary for TMSers.
  10. Sita

    Sita Well known member

    There are indeed many opinions regarding the vaccine, I agree. That article that I posted is about the opinion of a Nobel Prize winner virologist.

    Each TMS-er has to find what works for them in order to cope with this situation. There is no one size fits all solution.
    megank likes this.
  11. TG957

    TG957 Beloved Grand Eagle

    Since we started talking about opinions, I decided to chime in.

    Apparently, at least 7 Nobel Prize winner scientists disagree with Mr. Montagnier:

    https://www.voanews.com/episode/french-nobel-prize-laureates-receive-coronavirus-vaccine-4551696 (French Nobel Prize Laureates Receive Coronavirus Vaccine)

    I vaccinated at the first opportunity and so far did not become dead, infected or even experienced any side effects. Moreover, mass vaccinations in my area were followed by a dramatic decline in death and infections while at the same time businesses opened to public and people became less and less cautious. Whatever those new variants produced by vaccine that Mr. Montagnier predicted would flourish, they don't seem to cause death or infections where I live. Apparently, it works for this TMS-er - unless I am dead and unaware of it :=),
    Zuz, Cap'n Spanky and tgirl like this.
  12. stevow7

    stevow7 Well known member

    Thanks everyone for replying.
  13. LMB

    LMB Peer Supporter

    @Dorado sorry my comment was not directed at you, it was directed @mugwump on the comment about ‘your body your choice’.
    Dorado likes this.
  14. BloodMoon

    BloodMoon Beloved Grand Eagle

    I wish I could say the same about where I live. Despite living in the country that has the second highest vaccination rate of its population in the world (the UK) the new so called 'Indian variant' has only very recently arrived here and covid cases/infections due to this new 'Indian variant' have already increased 10.5% in the last week. So far, they don't think it's more 'deadly' or any more likely to cause serious illness than the 'Kent variant' that's been dominant here for quite a number of months; however, it is estimated to be 50% more contagious than the 'Kent variant' and the 'Kent variant' is much more contagious/transmissible and more liable to cause serious illness (I can't remember the %s) than the original covid 'strain' that swept the country over a year ago. Also, they are now reporting that we have yet another new variant here that's believed to have started in the English county of Yorkshire and is therefore seemingly 'home grown' in the UK; it's contagiousness etc., is as yet to be known/assessed. (Whether this has anything to do with the UK Government delaying second doses of the vaccines or not the jury's out on, except to say that the protection from any of the jabs is supposed to be pretty high after just one dose and delaying the jabs has apparently proven to actually increase protection overall.) What's currently happening in the UK makes me think the jury's also out with regard to whether Montagnier is right or not about vaccination promoting variants, albeit from what I've read elsewhere about him, I've gathered that he's a bit of a Maverick (and has some ideas about other stuff that seem quite weird to me).

    7 Nobel prize winners versus 1 Nobel prize winner...rightly or wrongly, I take the implication to be that because they are greater in number the 7 are likely to be right and the 1 is likely to be wrong. I was reading only today about a huge blunder made by the greater scientific establishment -- about how hard it was for some aerosol scientific experts to convince their 'colleagues' in the wider more influential scientific 'establishment' that covid is a disease that is not only spread by droplets, but is spread (far greater distances) by aerosol too. At least 35 of the top scientific experts in the scientific community/establishment wouldn't listen that covid was spread by aerosol; they kept their minds closed for a long time and erroneously believed that covid's particles were too big to 'float' in the air. As a result, the World Health Organisation didn't issue the advice for people to wear masks/face coverings for their own and others' protection until way into the pandemic and this resulted in countless unnecessary infections and deaths https://www.wired.com/story/the-teeny-tiny-scientific-screwup-that-helped-covid-kill/?utm_source=pocket-newtab-global-en-GB (The 60-Year-Old Scientific Screwup That Helped Covid Kill).

    I haven't decided whether or not I'm going to have the covid jabs, but from the 'yellow card' vaccine adverse side effect reports that are produced and updated on a weekly basis here in the UK, it seems that there is a big chance that the covid vaccines currently available to UK citizens would be very likely to trigger a serious worsening of a chronic condition that I suffer with (my swallowing and breathing muscles could be totally paralysed or intermittently paralysed...and that would likely shut me up for good!). However, I'm in my 60s and with an underlying health condition so I'm apparently statistically more liable to get very ill with covid than someone younger, without any underlying health conditions. So, it's not a simple no brainer decision for some of us; for some of us it's a big decision and huge dilemma, but I'm glad that I live in a country where I am allowed to make a considered choice in the matter (as far as it is currently possible to make a 'considered' choice as no one knows, for example, what long term side effects the vaccines may cause, if any). Just like I would do if I were to have a vaccine (and were to live to tell the tale!), should I decide not to have the vaccine, I shall protect others and myself by continuing to wear a mask and social distancing as best I can.

    Last edited: May 23, 2021
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  15. LMB

    LMB Peer Supporter

    Actually, I just heard news from the UK this morning that Pfizer and Astra are highly effective against the Indian variant. That is good news. Not everyone will agree with vaccine just like not everyone will agree with TMS. Lets hope that TMS is not a deterrent to or not to be vaccinated, let’s hope that only people with medical conditions can have that choice. I figure that no one wants to be sitting on an aircraft with someone not vaccinated, work with someone not vaccinated. I am sure there Will be more to come on this subject. Don’t be surprised if it becomes compulsory to be vaccinated. It is like that today, your kids probably can’t attend school as toddlers if they are not vaccinated. As this is not a forum on pros and cons of vaccinations lol, I wish you all good luck and keep the world safe.
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  16. BloodMoon

    BloodMoon Beloved Grand Eagle

    Our Government's Health Secretary said this morning on national TV that the Pfizer and AstraZenena vaccines are just as efficacious against the new India variant as they are against the Kent variant, but then the BBC TV news put up the figures that actually refute what he said...Imo our Government tends to go for the 'headline' they want, in the hope that the majority of people in this country will take notice of that 'headline' and few will bother to read the actual findings/figures, which are...

    A PHE (Public Health England) study, which took place between 5 April and 16 May, found that the Pfizer vaccine was 88% effective against symptomatic disease from the India variant two weeks after the second dose, compared with 93% effectiveness against the Kent variant. However, many millions more people in the UK have been vaccinated with the AstraZeneca jab than with the Pfizer -- two of the many reasons being because its cheaper and doesn't need the super low temperatures for storage that the Pfizer requires -- with people having no choice about which vaccine they received...and the AstraZeneca jab was found to be much less effective than the Pfizer, i.e. the AstraZeneca vaccine was found to be only 60% effective against the India variant and 66% effective against the Kent variant over the same period of the PHE study.

    Both vaccines were 33% effective against symptomatic disease from the India variant three weeks after the first dose, compared with about 50% against the Kent strain.

    The UK Government has recently decided to fork out for Pfizer jabs for the under 40s as it has apparently determined that with the under 40s the risk of dying of a blood clot caused by the AstraZeneca vaccine is potentially a bigger risk than them not having the AstraZeneca vaccine and catching covid and getting it severely and dying. The under 40s though are nevertheless being allowed the choice as to whether they have the AstraZeneca or Pfizer and we are told that they will be offered the Pfizer "whenever possible".

    With regard to Montagnier's theory of vaccines promoting variants though, what I believe he is actually saying is that he thinks that the better the vaccines are, the more likely the virus will mutate into other stronger variants. He is quoted as saying: "Many epidemiologists know it and are 'silent' about the problem known as 'antibody-dependent enhancement'." "It is clear that the new variants are created by antibody-mediated selection due to the vaccination." Whether he will be proved right or wrong about this in respect of covid only time will tell -- and I obviously hope he will be proved wrong.

    That's your opinion that you are obviously perfectly entitled to express. Your opinion is something that I don't personally agree with. I agree with Dorado though when he said: "I...believe we've come to a point where there are some strong opinions in this thread and trying to change them is unlikely on a mind-body forum." So, that's me done with this thread, except to say...

    Last edited: May 23, 2021
  17. TG957

    TG957 Beloved Grand Eagle

    @BloodMoon , I fully sympathize. You are in a tough spot. It is hard to live with the health condition which can be exacerbated by both COVID and vaccine! Those of us who can take the vaccine are doing it not only to protect ourselves, but also to protect those who can't get vaccinated due to their health conditions, like you. This what herd immunity is about. By stopping virus from spreading, 75% of the population who got vaccinated protect the other 25%. There is a lot of evidence that natural immunity from COVID is not as long lasting as the one from vaccine - so I would rather get vaccinated than gain natural immunity through infection.

    When the virus was raging in the US, I felt it was my civil duty to follow the rules. As a relatively healthy person (except for the history of various TMS conditions) I had a pretty good chance of a fairly painless recovery from COVID, but why adding to the burden of the already overworked healthcare system? Why making it harder for the doctors and nurses who would have to spend any of their time and effort on me while they had very sick people to look after? Why putting others at risk of getting infected by me, even if their chances to die or get very sick are fairly low compared to Ebola or MERS?

    So, I stayed at home as much as I could and avoided catching the virus. I view vaccination not only as a mean to protect myself, but also as a way to help those who can't get vaccinated. This is what civilized societies do. I was always of the opinion even before this pandemic that Japanese who habitually put on masks when they catch a respiratory infection so others would stay healthy show us the best example of civility.
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  18. Zuz

    Zuz Peer Supporter

    I really think that we need to accept lots of ‘unknown’ in the covid illness and vaccine because no one really knows long term anything and different gouvernements are trying what they can with the little we know.
    For someone anxious like me it’s nothing reassuring.
    I have auto immune diabetes since 8 years and even before that, I never really responded well to vaccines, but not very severe life threatening reactions . I was afraid about the vaccine. However, I know six people under 60 who dies of covid. Three of them with diabetes and three pretty healthy. I also know a man who had blood clots after covid, without any history of that and ended up with an amputated leg. I cannot put aside three other cases of sudden ‘unexplained’ deaths. The three did have covid not too bad, recuperated and a few weeks later died suddenly on unknown reasons. One was my uncle and we are waiting for the autopsy as the family started to wonder if it has anything to do with previous covid infection.
    Basically, from my anxiety point of view, every time I would think about perhaps skipping the vaccine and wait something like this would happen. I have never lost that many people in one year.
    So eventually, I decided that my anxiety will be less with unknown long term risks of vaccination and now that I had the first dose ( in my country the second dose is very delayed due to lack of vaccines) I don’t regret it and to my pleasant surprise, my anxiety is css as lm and not at all worried about the long term effects. I really appreciate that part of my brain :).
    My only worry is to bot have a huge back pain flare up after the second dose as ai did after the first. But back pain being mostly TMS i will survive it if it happens at second dose again.

    In my (informed as much as possible but very imperfect) opinion the variants are a scary possibility and will continue for years from countries that do not have many vaccines. In order to mutate, the virus must reproduce so be spread alot. There are more chances of mutations when there is lots of spread. I don’t know if we will ever get to the end of it if less fortunate countries don’t have enough good vaccines? :(
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  19. NameK

    NameK Well known member

    As someone who has unfortunately had covid in will give my two cents.

    I plan on getting vaccinated within the next week or so because after what I went through with it I definitely don't want that again.

    Thing about covid is it doesn't care if your a healthy individual you can still get pretty sick. I would say I'm pretty healthy minus the fact that I smoke weed other then that i don't have any underlying issues other then some tms stuff of course.

    It's a new virus and our bodies don't know how to react to it.

    It's essentially luck of the draw (yes most people are fine and recover with no after effects but perfectly healthy people with no underlying conditions aren't as fortunate likely due to cyotine storms where the immune system overreacts

    But there are people who are getting these long covid symptoms despite having mild symptoms only and not being hospitalized. Only about 8% of people that have been hospitalized are ones reporting long haul symptoms.

    They are estimating that 1/3 patients are still experiencing atleast 1 symptom after having it for up to a year. My taste and smell for certain things is still messed up.

    they are guessing about 10% I dont think it's as high as 30% are experiencing long haul symptoms.

    And whether these are tms or not have yet be determined for some people it definitely is but for others who's to say ?

    I know the vaccine can give people anxiety because of the unknown long terms effects.

    But most vaccine long term effects show up within the first 3ish months or so statically speaking and I would rather take my chance with the vaccine then roll the dice with covid again.

    But at the end of the day it's up to the own individual and their choice.

    My dad isn't getting it because "I've already has covid I don't need it" but he doesn't understand you can get it again and immunity is not understood in how long it actually lasts ita been over 6 months now so the likely hood that we are immune still is unlikely.

    My younger brother also isn't getting it (he didn't get covid when the rest of the family had it)
    And he said he doesn't trust the vaccine and would rather take his chances with covid despite having an auto immune (chrons) and being someone who vapes nicotine.

    But that's his choice and if we ever does get it I hope he's okay same with my dad if he ever got it again.
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  20. megank

    megank Newcomer

    Definitely a personal choice. At this time I'm choosing not to receive the vaccine, though that may change. My family members are pressuring to the point of bribing me to take the vaccine. They are so fearful and pushing their fear onto me the best they can. I know it's because they care but it is very distressing and their judgments are really sharp and accusatory. This is actually the most distressing thing that has contributed to my recent TMS flare ups.
    I'm not completely anti-vaccine, though. There is a vaccine being developed called Novavax, which I may end up taking if/when it comes out. It seems to me to be more of a "tried and true" delivery system, as opposed to the new mRNA vaccines. I would consider the Johnson & Johnson, but would like to know that the blood clotting issues are figured out first, like why did the individuals who developed the issues, develop them. I do believe I had Covid back in the summer of 2020, but I did not get tested as I was living in a small town where we were advised not to come into the (one small) clinic. It did suck but I healed, and I was sure not to go out for two weeks (ordered food delivery boxes and didn't leave my yard) in case I could spread whatever I had to someone who was vulnerable.
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