Vaccine Triggering Symptoms? Looking for help and advice

Thanks, Metta.

 

I pray so too.

 

Hey there, how are you faring?

 

Hi Metta,

I'm faring okay -- so far so good, anyway. (With my rare autoimmune disorder it originally came on insidiously, so if it were to progress, triggered by the vaccine, it would probably take weeks to months to show up in a profound way, but I will keep remembering that statistical study I found which indicated that that is unlikely to happen.) Side effects-wise all I've had is some arm tenderness and soreness (but thankfully no redness, swelling or inflammation) in the muscle where the jab went in (that they warn you about)...it came on after a few hours, worsened over night, but is now gradually diminishing. I took your advice and had dinner already prepared for the evening after my jab in the afternoon and took things easy. I also had a slight headache which wasn't bad enough to take any paracetamol for. So, fingers crossed, I'll continue to feel like my 'normal' self. I thought of you as I put my mask on to go into the vaccination centre, having first sprayed some of that anti-covid nasal spray up my nose for extra protection ... The vaccination centre was full of 17 to 18 year olds having their Pfizer jabs...all the oldies like me had their jabs ages ago, so the staff looked somewhat surprised when I said I'd come for my 1st dose. Eight weeks to go before I get my 2nd jab.

How are you doing? I hope you are continuing to do well.

 

Hey there,
great to hear you're doing ok. I think if you haven't had stronger side effects by now, they're not going to come, though you may feel an odd twitch or something here and there. Yes, hang onto the statistical study - this is what I do too when fears start up, I remind myself that of the two, delta is likely to be worse and more damaging. Am I allowed to say I'm proud of you? Are you proud of yourself? It also doesn't matter that you are later; judging by the amount of vaccine hesitancy or fear around, I'd say there's thousands of people who are older and have delayed it. So at least now you've got around 32% protection. From the article you sent me I got a nasal spray too (not the same brand) and use it when I go out, but there seems to be two types that claim - or potentially claim - to be effective: carrageenan based ones and Xylitol based. I got the carrageenan with saline. It can't hurt, feels good, and may do some good, but I also mask up thoroughly. I also read somewhere that with delta, double-masking (one cloth, one surgical) is more effective. I'm doing well, thank you, though in lockdown.

 

Absolutely allowed - and thank you, Metta! Being able to discuss this with you has helped tremendously. Along the way, I have talked with my husband about what was best to do, but it's obviously more difficult for family members to be totally objective.

Tbh I feel relieved more than proud that I was finally able to make a decision; the dilemma and indecision of it all was weighing heavily on me - far more heavily, as it turns out, than I thought it was weighing.

Like you, I reached a point where I became convinced that, even if having the jabs turned out not to be the best course of action for me and my particular genetics -- what with the Delta variant being so much more transmissible and possibly more serious/deadly than the other variants -- I would end up regretting not getting the jabs...

The Delta variant took away any hope that I previously had that, with the huge uptake of the vaccine in England and the rest of the UK, covid would fade to a low background level within the next year or so and I might be able to dodge getting it...New cases of the Delta variant are plateauing at a whopping circa 30,000 per day here and the consensus of scientific opinion seems to be that levels are very likely going to continue to be in that region of 20,000 to 30,000 a day for the foreseeable future...I was surprised to hear that seasonal flu cases are usually around the 20,000 new cases a day mark, so the prospect of new covid cases continuing to be very high is very believable in my opinion and therefore the world for the unvaccinated is likely to continue to be far more dangerous than for the double jabbed who are currently, for the most part, being kept from getting it badly and ending up in hospital.

In some ways, I regret not getting my jabs earlier, but delaying has meant that I've made much more of an informed decision that I feel I can have peace of mind with. If I hadn't have waited, I wouldn't have seen that statistical study that indicates that the mRNA jabs are unlikely to worsen my rare autoimmune condition (as it was only published last month) and I wouldn't have seen the case studies that showed that covid itself can trigger my rare autoimmune condition in people. I also wouldn't have had the choice of having the Pfizer...Back in March (before the blood clot issue became apparent) people in my age group (I'm in my early 60s) were only being allowed the AZ and I only now managed to get the Pfizer because my GP's surgery started giving the Pfizer to the under 40s (as per Government decree) and I was allowed to have it too as they don't have the AZ. If I'd have gone to a mass vaccination centre, it would still have been the AZ or no jab at all...And, although I haven't been diagnosed with a blood clotting disorder, I do get some blood pooling at times in my legs, for which doctors have been unable to give me a diagnosis, so having the AZ would have had additional concerns for me.

Forgive me for prattling on with the above; it just feels good to summarise my reasonings and write/type all this stuff down and send it to someone who more than understands.

I also got a carrageenan based spray -- it's the brand that's being further trialled at the University of Cardiff in Wales. I've also just heard about a nasal spray that contains hypromellose (known as hydroxypropyl methylcellulose, or HPMC). In a trial it apparently gave protection against covid (to include against the Delta variant) -- seemingly reducing the risk of catching it by 78% https://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/taffix-blocks-the-delta-variant-of-sars-cov-2-in-addition-to-the-alpha-uk-and-beta-south-african-variant-301336316.html (Taffix® blocks the Delta Variant of SARS-CoV-2 in addition to the Alpha (UK) and Beta (South African) Variant). If these sprays do work as well as touted, it will be great because it would make going for dental appointments less risky.

I'm sorry to hear that you're in lockdown. I just saw on the news that half of Australia is atm and that there have been protests in Sydney and Melbourne. What a time this is - as one country opens up, another goes into lockdown. I do so hope they manage to speed up your vaccination programme.

Thanks again -- for sharing your thoughts and for all your help, Metta.

 

Hi BloodMoon
I guess we got each other over the line, somehow! Yes, I too found husband not much help and made things worse.
I looked up Taffix and OMG I would need to take out a small personal loan for it!
I did however find one similar in my own country at about 1/3 the price.

Also, the carrageenan based ones, I found a complaint about the one I bought. Apparently they've been a bit creative with the research so they could make the claims that they are making.
I'm linking the complaint because the same product, carragelose, has links back to one company, Marininomed, who allegedly funded the research, which means it has an inherent bias.
I'm not saying the product doesn't work, only that my particular brand of it is a company who has, well, lied before.

Given that the one you linked me to is also carragelose (TM), it too may be linked back to Marinomed, and therefore, may be the product of biased research or over-blown claims or just lies, like it seems my one is.
The studies may be worthless, I don't know.

Also, whether the complaint actually ever made it to the TGA in Australia or not also I don't know.

Perhaps you might be able to find out some on your end?

Yeah, I've been thinking about dentist appointments and how to get around that, too.

https://www.medreach.com.au/wp-cont...laint-to-TGA-Mundicare-Cold-Defence-Spray.pdf

hope you're doing well

 

Hi Metta,

Thanks for the info and link re the carrageenan spray that you bought.

I've found out that the Swansea University/Cardiff University clinical trial results on the carragelose (TM) nasal spray (that I bought) won't be known until December this year https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT04590365 (Carrageenan Nasal Spray for COVID-19 Prophylaxis - Full Text View - ClinicalTrials.gov). The carragelose spray being used in the trial is associated with Marinomed, but the trial is double blind and randomized, so it looks to be pretty pukka.

With regard to the Taffix 'trial' (I should've more accurately used the word 'study' rather than 'trial' before) the researchers give more information here https://www.researchsquare.com/article/rs-100328/v1 (Low pH Hypromellose (Taffix™) nasal powder spray reduced SARS-CoV-2 infection rate post mass-gathering event at a highly endemic community: An observational prospective open label user survey) and as you will see their conclusion was: "Our prospective user survey showed lower SARS-CoV-2 infection rates in Taffix users during a high risk mass gathering. No adverse events were reported. further evaluation by controlled clinical trials is warranted to confirm its findings and define ways to encourage better compliance." I'll therefore do a bit of googling to see if a proper double blind and randomized trial is being done somewhere in the world on Taffix or any similar nasal spray containing hypromellose. I'll let you know if I find that there is one.

So, atm, I guess it's a case of "yer pays yer money and takes yer chance" with regard to which nasal spray to opt for and use (if any). I'm not sure whether I'll send for some Taffix or not. I can get it here in UK from the EU without needing a second mortgage (albeit it is still pretty expensive) but, that said, I would have to buy a pack of 4 and I only really need 2. I sent a message a number of days ago to the sellers asking a question about what the shelf life/expiry date on the bottles is likely to be if I ordered some, but they haven't bothered to reply. I might just stick with taking a punt on using the carragelose spray, which is much easier to get hold of and a lot cheaper.

Keep well and best wishes,
BM

 

Just wanted to chime in on my experience with the vaccine in regards to tms symptoms after.

So real quick after my first shot I had chills, fever first 2 days and some joint pain for about 3 weeks after and looking back I'm wondering how much of it was from it versus tms making it linger.

Also technically my 1st shot would in some countries be considered myv2nd because I had covid back in Nov 2020.

But here in Canada we need both to be considered fully vaccinated.

Also at the time I had to wait 7 weeks to receive my 2nd dose anyways.

So about a week or so before my 2nd I spoke to my primary care doctor to ask whether I should get the 2nd given my reaction to the first.

She said since my symptoms subsided 2-3 weeks after I should be fine with the 2nd if I felt comfortable doing so as obviously it was my own choice.

So I got it on July 23rd and it was alot milder then my 1st only had a headache and slightly sore arm for a day or two.

3 days after I started having sinus pressure, brain fog like, out of it that lasted a few weeks.

Spoke to my gp and she said she didn't think it was related and of course I was reading online and didn't believe her.

But I think she was right because I had these exact symptoms way before I was ever vaccinated back in April.

So I think i had a tms flare reaction but I'm completely fine now and in glad I did my part in getting vaccinated and I realize I got all worried and worked uo about if for no reason.

Really hope this doesn't spark any debate about it because at the end of the day it your choice if you want to get it or not.

I decided despite already having covid and I know some people like my dad feel that having it before is good enough protection on its own and that's his desicion I'm not harassing him to get it because it's his choice.

I think there is too much fighting today about things we don't agree on even if we believe it may be the wrong choice in our eyes.

For some their reasoning doesn't make sense to us and they have their own beliefs and reasoning that we don't understand. But we all have tms symptoms and we are all trying to improve them and ourselves and this pandemic shouldn't divide us from that

Hope your all having a wonderful day